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2nd class 2016 booklet x 4 large

 
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TMR24
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Joined: 22 Oct 2016
Posts: 3
Location: FAREHAM, HAMPSHIRE

PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2016 11:46 pm    Post subject: 2nd class 2016 booklet x 4 large Reply with quote

I have been trying to buy a 2016 2nd x 4 large booklet. I have tried Royal Mail Tallents house twice, first time they sent MA15, left it a couple of months, ordered again and this time they sent MA14. Tried my local sub post office who said they did not stock these booklets. Next went to main Post Office in town who refused to let me check year code before I purchased them, so left without buying. Yesterday I was in another local town and went in to their Post Office and purchased 1 book without checking the code. When I got home I checked the book using an eye glass, I first looked at the top right stamp and it was M15L but I could not seem to see the MFIL source code, then realised it should be reading MA15. I then checked the other 3 stamps and they were MA14 / MFIL. So my question is this, is it known that the Post Office would sell a stamp booklet with mixed date/source codes. In this case 3 stamps x MA14/MFIL and 1 stamp MAIL/M15L? I have not altered this book in any way it is as purchased from a main town Post Office.
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crazyh1
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Joined: 20 Nov 2010
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Location: Lincolnshire, UK

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

are you able to upload a photo of this for us to see - sounds interesting.

Scott
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TMR24
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Joined: 22 Oct 2016
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2016 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi, As I am new to forum can you tell me how I add a picture to my reply if I can get a good enough photo
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Gooner
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Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 1271
Location: England, UK

PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi - you can get all the information you need to upload an image form the FAQ section:
http://stamp-collector.co.uk/MachinForum/viewtopic.php?t=12

But ignore the 1st one as if you had your own web-site then you would know how to do this (and as you can see it is now broken as this web-site no longer exists!!!).. Read the hints for using either Photobucket or another Cloud that you may use (e.g. Dropbox).

As a last resort - email the pictures to me ( dave@stamp-collector.co.uk ) and I will load them up for you.
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Dave
http://www.stamp-collector.co.uk
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cdj1122
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Joined: 08 Jul 2007
Posts: 953
Location: Houston, Texas pending eye surgery

PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be clear, are you saying that the sheetlet has four stamps, one of which is coded differently from the three adjacent stamps ???
I do not see, or properly understand , how that can occur without fiddling with the printing process while the die was being prepared.
It is my understanding that once the master image has been created the image is then reproduced or transferred electronically to the printing plate.


□ Yes ?
□ No ?
□ Probably ?
□ Sometimes ?
□ Maybe ?
□ In the past, but no longer ?
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Charlie Jensen
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cdj1122
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Joined: 08 Jul 2007
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Location: Houston, Texas pending eye surgery

PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose there could have been a problem transferring the image and some clever devil reset one of the stamp images to create the fourth stamp only to have used a different master image .
Since they are working with reverse views, possible also inverted to the naked eye, some teckie might not see any better than I can (Marginally).
If so, the next query would be does the mis-dating affect the whole printed sheet or just one "panel", and the whole printing run or less. Was there a giant screw up causing RM to recall booklets, thus accounting for the difficulty you are having acquiring the booklet you were, and probably still are, seeking?
All this should lead to a mad scramble to re-examine postally used 2nd Large examples spread around the world.
It sounds like the best thing since the p LB turquoise hit the streets.
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Charlie Jensen
Lecanto, Florida
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Gooner
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Joined: 25 May 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 7:57 pm    Post subject: Occam's razor Reply with quote

Hi Terry ,
Thanks ....Got your original image which is displayed below.



Unfortunately I have some bad news for you.
I think it is fairly obvious what has happened, but it is only my opinion.

What looks like has happened is that a Post Office Clerk has (for whatever reason) a booklet of 3 which obviously could not be sold to the general public.

I believe he/she has removed one M15L stamp remaining from a DLR sheet and placed it into the booklet in the top right position to make it saleable.

Not only does it have M15L but it does not have the MFIL (see marked copy of image below. It has been put on very slightly askew as you can see on the enlarged image.



Unfortunately it was not a normal member of the public (who wouldn't care) that walked through the door - it was a stamp - collector - you.
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Dave
http://www.stamp-collector.co.uk
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TMR24
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Joined: 22 Oct 2016
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for looking at this Dave, that was the conclusion that I had come to
Ie: that the top right stamp had been damaged and was replaced by one from a counter sheet. Guess best now used for postage and start the search for a good copy all over again.
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tangles2010
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Joined: 26 Jul 2010
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Location: Canberra, Australia

PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 12:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting stuff though, so thank you for posting it!
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cdj1122
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Joined: 08 Jul 2007
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Location: Houston, Texas pending eye surgery

PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A great example of why a scan is needed to solve a puzzlement..
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J. T. Hurd
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2016 2:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gents:
One further (elementary) observation: It is obvious, even without checking the source codes that the upper right stamp was clearly part of a different printing, because it is centred VF and the other three are only centred F.

Thank you for an interesting and enlightening conversation.

James T. Hurd.
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cdj1122
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Joined: 08 Jul 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2016 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sure once we have the scan so many things are wrong, from the virtual impossibility based on what we know of the die/image reproduction process through the mis-alignment to the different centering, and what seems to be differences in the jewels of the tiara and possibly the pearls of the necklace. Although the last may be just my failing eyesight.
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Charlie Jensen
Lecanto, Florida
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