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Storing and Displaying Cyl. blocks and booklet panes

 
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lammetje
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 1:48 pm    Post subject: Storing and Displaying Cyl. blocks and booklet panes Reply with quote

Happy New Year to you all.

I have been away for a while, but back again now (I won't bore you with the details).

On my recent travels back to the homeland, I scored a few blocks and booklets - and this has got me hooked. Before now I only collected singles (both used and mint). We are talking Machins, of course...

This gives me the problem of HOW to store/display them.
I would also ideally like to write everything up really nicely (that's a big part of the fun/hobby for me).

So 2 questions:
For any of you who collect cylinder blocks and/or booklet panes, how do you go about (permanently) storing and displaying them? Any tips? I could use stockbooks, I suppose, but they are not ideal for write-ups. It is really not quite what I have in mind....

Secondly, I am not at all interested in the booklet covers, only the actual panes themselves (as I am sure you all know, booklet panes are often the only source for most rarer machins). The reason why the 1/2p LB is in fact a LB is gloriously obvious when you see the pane from the Wedgewood booklet (which i am lucky to have). I like booklet panes, they appeal to me, it gives the collecting another dimension.

So anyway, I only want to keep the panes themselves - mostly for display reasons again.
With Prestige booklets and stitched booklets, that's not a problem. They come apart easily. But with folded booklets the selvege is fixed (glued?) to the cover.
The obvious solution is to simply tear the pane from the selvege. However I have not done that yet, because I do not want to regret having done it later.

Again, is there anyone with a soluton/ideas/tips on how to approach this?

I realise it is my own personal collection and I probably would never sell it anyway, but I want to be able to sleep at night not thinking I have instantly de-valued (or de-faced) something valuable (whilst at the same getting the most 'fun factor' out of my collection.

I always listen to voices of experience Smile

Thanks!
Best regards,
Mike

PS without access to my reference books at this moment, I suddenly realise I do not know how to spell selvege Smile I think it might be selvage.
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Gooner
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

selvedge - I believe
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Alex
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You could go to the expense of large size hawid (or similar) mounts, or, my choice - photocorners.

Alex.
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Gooner
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry Alex I violently disagree with photo-corners. Evil or Very Mad

I had a number of albums I purchased that had booklets filed using these and apart from bends if not applied EXACTLY ... the glue leaks over time and can stick to the pane (or booklet cover). I spent a lot of time recently removing all photo corners and disposing of them whilst swearing about the number of panes I was having to split because one or two stamps were adhered to them. They had all been in these albums for more than 10 years at the time.

There are numerous ways of doing this - the best will always be the most expensive - that's the way the world turns - and the best without any doubt is purchasing the right size HAWID (or similar quality) "GARD" type mounts and lightly applying adhesive to the top of the mount only. If the the adhesive is not strong enough then they can be re-glued without any concern over the booklet.

Another way is to purchase something like the Lighthouse (4 or 13 ring) or Lindner albums and again buying the correct size pages (I don't know the reference numbers but they are easy to find).

Like I say these are the expensive but safe ways to store them. I have a mixture of both and indeed some of the Stanley Gibbons Booklet Albums (I have a lot of booklets Shocked )

My advice - aim for the best solution that makes practical (financial) sense taking into account what YOU want to achieve by it. My first suggestion (the mounts) does mean an initial outlay (but not that expensive) and you can then position them anywhere on the page and leave yourself whatever space is necessary to add your notes knowing the booklet (pane) is safely filed.

If I get the chance over the weekend I will scan a few different ways I have mine filed.
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lammetje
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the advice both of you - I had not even thought of Hawid/Gard mounts, to be honest. Have used Davo mounts (which are similar) for my single stamps, my local shop always has only limited stock and I only saw the smaller sizes in there, so did not think further...

I am also interested now you mention it in those 13 ring Lighthouse/Lindner - I again did not know you could get 'specialist' or correct size pages for such items.

My preference I think (at this stage) is for loose pages, regardless of type of pages - ideally multi ring - and the ability for fairly copious notes/write ups. I am not averse to doing the write-ups on seperate bits of paper and inserting them alongside the panes/blocks somehow. Overall, for me it must look neat and professional. My aim is to build a collection to be personally proud of.
I hope this gives you a picture.....

Expense is not the limit (within reasonable limits Smile

Gooner, if you COULD make some scans, that would be really fantastic - it would help me a lot to 'visualize' things.
Must surely be of benefit to others as well, it's always great (imho) to see how other people arrange their collections.

Many thanks in advance!!

Cheers,
Mike
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cdj1122
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RE: the corner mounts.
.
I tried using them on some of the covers that I had to show single usage of certain Machins during the period of usage. Now it could be the brand of corners I used, but between the difficulty I have with clumsey fingers mounting them in the first place and the numerous times one or the other cover dismounted itself, I gve up on that and now have them in the appropriate size "Vario" black double sided pages.
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Alex
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave,

Thanks for the warning.........I'll need to rethink my options.

Alex.
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brandenburg5
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For cylinder blocks and booklet panes, I use stock sheets such as Prinz. I then do the writeup on a plain sheet of paper and insert it in the binder such that the writeup is visible on the left side opposite the stock sheet.

This is perhaps not as elegant as using mounts and having the writeup right next to the stamps, but it is a lot easier!

By the way, selvage is more common in the US and selvedge in the UK.

--Larry
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Gooner
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 2:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brandenburg5 wrote:

By the way, selvage is more common in the US and selvedge in the UK.
--Larry


That's interesting - I thought I knew most of the "Americanisations" of English words with all the US authors I have read - but hadn't seen that one before. Strange really because I have Scotts albums and although this sort of thing tends to attract my eye I hadn't noticed it. Next time I get a Scotts out I shall look for this.

Amazing what you can learn as a stamp collector.
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BrianT
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A couple of snaps showing how I do it, bearing in mind my status as a rank beginner.

Stanley Gibbons Q11 22 ring binders and pages. Then designed, if that that's not a overstatement, using Word and printed out on an Epson R2400. The stamps are then mounted using Prinz 'Gard' mounts, thanks to Charlie's advice. In early times I started using Hawid but found them to be a pain, the Gards make the whole thing fun.






Incidentally the catalogue numbers shown are from the Stoneham, I like the pretty pictures and the straightforward presentation.
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lammetje
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Larry / Gooner - thanks - that is the way I am planning to go now, at least for the moment.
As I have already so many booklets and blocks, it makes sense (especially as my collection is still far, far from being complete, so the overall layout will change constantly).

However

@Brian - Many thanks! Your display layout (and home made pages) look fantastic!!
Really lots of compliments. This is what I had - more or less - originally in my mind's eye. As and when I complete the various parts of my collection, for the blocks and panes, and coils, then this is how I would like the finished display (along very similar lines).

The complete booklets (as opposed to panes) can remain in the Hagner type pages.

It's a dream, but I plan on collecting 1 of each booklet and also 1 one of each unique booklet pane/page (to be displayed seperately). There are fewer unique panes than total booklets (hence the decision to split them).

Question: It is a little difficult to make it out from your photo, but for your booklet panes, are they still attached to the actual booklets?
If you have managed to remove them - then PLEASE could let me know how you did that without also losing the selvage/selvedge.....

Thanks!

This thread has been a BIG help to me
Regards,
Mike
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BrianT
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Mike.

But re your question.

Sorry I bought them as a collection and they had already been seperated.

Regards,

Brian
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Gooner
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike
Removing panes from Folded Booklets - haven't done a lot of this - but it is possible - just have to be VERY careful. I believe there are liquids available to do the job - I just don't trust them and as I say I do it so rarely I haven't experimented with any of them - maybe other members have.

On the filing of Cylinder blocks - this is a method I tried early on and it worked for me.

Not as neat as Brian's by any stretch of the imagination. The actual is a lot cleaner than the scan shows - what you can't see (because it is an A4 scanner) is that I have inserted each sheet into a plastic folder (these things you can get for 73p for 100 at ASDA right now!). This allows me to use many of the various ring folders I have. However it has made the scan look dirty. (Forget the black round the outside that is just a cover I use in the scanner.



These are A4 sheets. Many years ago I created an EXCEL listing of all my cylinder blocks. I then imported these into an ACCESS database. Within the database I created the printable page you can see and it can also transfer the data from the database into the assigned columns. However on this particular page I printed a blank one and wrote it by hand (can't for the life of me think why now). This type of page can be created in other MS Office products such as MS Publisher or even MS Word.

FYI - I have a "Note" column in the database which allows me to add any comments I want - I find this easier than writing by hand (as my handwriting probably shows) as I only have to do it once.
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lammetje
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like it Dave - I like it very much.
Thanks for sharing this.

I had actually thought about utilising those cheapo type of plastic/PVC pockets/sleeves - I have loads of them - but I was a bit worried about them being 'safe' long term. I guess they must be if you yourself are using them (but then, you also have the blocks in mounts inside those pockets for extra safety.

For the point regarding separating some of my booklet panes from the booklets, I have got some UHU stamp remover, which I sometimes used on stubborn used covers.
I thought about trying this solution - just a tiny amount applied with a tiny brush along the selvedge, but I am a bit worried about it 'seeping' across to the actual stamps. Guess I will just try this with one of my lower value booklets - and try another one by just pulling slowly and carefully...
Peel it and see - as the Velvet Underground would have it.

Thanks again - I do really appreciate your inputs here.

Regards,
Mike
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Alex
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Following Dave getting violent with me (see above Crying or Very sad ) I have been looking at cost effective ways of mounting my Scottish Lion cylinder blocks. I had to find something that would do the standard 6 corner block as well as the Waddington 8 corner block.

The answer - Showgard 100mm strips and a guillotine. This size is perfect for block with angled selvedge, and, as recommended, if you only adhere one of the flaps you can still remove the bloc at a later date should you need to.

They only come in packs containing 10 strips (£6), however, for angle-cut blocks I can get 3 per strip - 30 per pack - which works out at 20p per mount.

Square cut blocks can be accomodated 4 per strip - 40 per pack - 15p per mount.

The stamps are contained so completely that I may go back to non acid free A4 paper (unless Dave shouts at me again LOL!) of a heavier guage to support the extra weight.

I have also resorted back to hand-written notes and description, rather than printed ones which take too long to produce and allows more freedom to add to the page at a later date.

For each XS** I intend having one page for a mint (including XS**a errors) and used example along with blocks; then page 2 for my obsession with flea - speck varieties. Single stamps are mounted in the standard machin - sized mounts.

Each page is then protected in an A4 pocket mounted in a 4 D-ring album.

RESULT Very Happy

Alex.
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cdj1122
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess my habit of using four or five quality hinges across the top is not going to float, eh ?
Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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Alex
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Old habits die hard Charlie......each to his own!

Alex.
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Derek Burch
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 30, 2011 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose that my licking the top pair of stamps wouldn't be approved, either. It does keep them in place, though.
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suzeb
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:59 pm    Post subject: Storing PSB panes Reply with quote

I know this is an old post but I'm only just reading it as I have started thinking about how to store my PSB panes both fine used and mint.
Those stuck on FDC's are all neatly stored in 240x130mm Lindner protection sleeves which not only keep them clean but also add a little bit of stiffening unlike the paper sleeves with one clear side.
I have previously used the trick someone suggested of a Hawid mount. These are available on-line from any philatelist store worth its name. I have only 2 regular stores anywhere near driving distance from where I live in the west of Holland and I prefer to shop for the accessories via the Internet nowadays. It saves on parking fees and also the chance that the store isn't stocking exactly what I want at the time I visit.
I have recently had a small brain storm and suddenly thought of the loose pages which can be bought from Hema or a good supplier of stationery. I was thinking of the sleeves which people store postcards in. The only trouble I can see is that the pane might be slightly too big (I haven't done any measuring yet!) Bank note albums might too be a solution and I would certainly think that loose FDC pages like the ones DAVO make would do the job OK. It really all depends on how much a person is willing to invest in storage capabilities. Up until now I've been adding the odd pane to my general DAVO album pages, usually opposite where the Machin is stored in its mount but sometimes on a separate 'empty' DAVO page. But this is resulting in my albums becoming too bulky with all the 'additions' and I think I should find a different solution.
I can, of course, thin out my current 6 albums to 7 which means that the 'extras' won't be squashed as they are at present.
I would rather keep the panes in the albums (6 for mint GB and 6 for fine used) I already have my FDC's stored away from the albums in plastic lidded boxes and don't really want to have to look in too many different places when I want to browse through my collection of add to it.
I'll see what Hema have to offer in the way of postcard sleeves which I can store in a ring-binder and otherwise start making use of DAVO albums number 7 Wink
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Gooner
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Suzeb, firstly- never any issue with adding comments to old posts. It can be good to revisit some of the points from time to time.

Secondly, I think rather than asking for advice you are probably just outlining your thoughts on paper, again good.
All the options you suggest are viable.
In addition there is an [expensive] Connoisseur album specifically for PSB panes, which I especially like but I think it runs out at about 2002.

In any case - I think your preferred solution of thinning out and adding further DAVO albums would be the most pleasantly aesthetic way to go and would certainly be my choice, if it were my choice.

Enjoy
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suzeb
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 09, 2016 4:13 pm    Post subject: Storing PSB panes Reply with quote

Thanks for the advice Gooner.

And yes - you got it correct! I was thinking/writing out aloud but will take the feedback seriously. I had already decided that putting my 7th empty album †o use would be the way to go Wink
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Glyjo
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2016 10:23 am    Post subject: Cylinder Block Perforation Placement Reply with quote

Maybe not strictly to do with Cylinder block storage but I have often wondered why there is no ‘user scale ’relating to the positions of perforations with respect to the stamp image to enable the grading of cylinder blocks. The Loveland scale for booklet perforations is one accepted as a standard and widely used.
Douglas Myall in Deegam states in Appendix 5 page 7 under the heading ‘Centring’ collectors should endeavour to obtain cylinder blocks where the perforations are placed centrally in the inter-stamp gutters. With that in mind my question. Is there a scale unknown to me and unused and secondly if not as collectors do we need one?.

The reason I believe we need a scale is to aid both the seller and buyer. I no longer purchase cylinder blocks from well-known club auction lists and many internet sites as you have no idea of the perforation placement.

Having bought many CBs before I purchase my Deegam I have my own simple three /six letter code which I use for my own identification purposes
VP Vertical Perforation followed by C – Centre : R- Indent Right : L- Indent Left
HP Horizontal Perforation followed by C – Centre : T- Indent Top : B Indent Bottom

A cylinder block with centrally well-positioned perforations is coded as VPC HPC where as VPL HPB indicates the vertical perforations are off centre to the left and the horizontal offset nearer the stamp beneath. In allocating my code I do not use any magnification with a vernier scale although there's nothing to prevent one doing so.

If you take a look at CBs for sale from dealers on the internet which use scans to display the actual stamps you’ll see very few blocks achieve a VPC HPC as most perforations are offset in one of both axes.
So for CB collectors out there I'd be interested to know how you source the 'perfect' Cylinder Blocks.
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phos45
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2016 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

freeing glued stamps - PRINZ hinge remover

freeing adhesives - heptane (rubber cement thinner)
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